Yep, definitely not saying that we’re not below the replacement numbers despite certain demographics having more access and increases! The replacement number itself is so generic.

It’s based on developed country’s requirements without taking migration into account. So it’s not what most developed countries talking about declining birth rates, are actually aiming for. Australia, for example, is built on immigration, our goal being based on no immigration makes no sense! Other countries (Ireland for example) still have a high rate of emigration. A lot to take into consideration outside the very generic replacement number of 2.1 when you start to narrow it down 😅 You’re right about Israel in terms of developed countries! They’re sitting at ~2.9!

Some of the rhetoric I see seems to be that the birth rates have “suddenly” dropped which is far from accurate.

I’m looking at a couple of countries but particularly Australia. Contraception being introduced (early 60s) had a big effect as did the accessibility of abortion (70s). In fact, it appears that the biggest “sudden drop” actually occured through the 70s/early 80s. I wonder if they were speaking about it in the alarmist way we (society) do now.

Interestingly - Australia - teen pregnancies have dropped 75% since the 1970s. Gonna say this is a good thing about declining birth rates. 👏

I’m no data analyst but I think that it looks like the biggest factor for declining birth rates came with birth control. If not for that I think the graphs would look relatively stable with smaller fluctuations.

Australia actually had a small increase in the early 2020s! Still below 2.1 though!

I don’t know, it’s all very interesting. I think there are a lot of very good things about the birth rate having dropped. Found a study around the decreasing rate of “undesired births”. Such a nuanced topic! I’m sure there’s more numbers out there for individual countries about the projection around migration numbers needed rather than focusing on the generic replacement number.

A few of the sources I read;

https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/people/population/historical-population/latest-release

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12205728/

https://www.id.com.au/insights/articles/australias-birth-rate-increases-for-the-first-time-in-10-years/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7834459/

😅 right some hyperbole there or what! I actually don’t disagree with the rest of that comment about nature and community but you really lose people by starting with wild statements like western culture is a disease! It’s sad because they probably had some decent points (nature, community etc) but override that with the flair of the dramatic and it’s hard to take seriously!

Haha, it’s interesting. I’m a lesbian, never had an interest in kids. My brother is straight, never been interested in kids. My sister is a lesbian and has had two kids (so far?). It’s just interesting to see what different people see as the barriers/reasons for not having kids (not having a dig, it’s genuinely interesting!)

That’s where it would be fascinating to see the statistics laid out for so many things side by side; how many more LGBTQ people are having families than in the past, same with infertile people, single people (more rare but it happens!) and then the ways that it’s decreased too elsewhere. There are groups who are having more kids than ever before - because it’s more accessible (IVF) and then obviously groups that aren’t.

Then of course the way that life expectancy has increased which is where the balance gets tricky and the numbers are important.

I’m also curious if 4-5 kid families are still more common in any western countries than others. I’m in Australia and agree that they’re rare here now. I’d see 2 as the norm though I’m going to jump down a rabbit hole now 😅 🐇

Green (before I read your whole post, just the question)

I mean I feel like these numbers have been decreasing since mortality rates increased. People used to have 5-10 kids because they knew they likely wouldn’t all live through childhood. It makes sense that people realized that shift and that having 10 kids who survived wasn’t easy! So yes that plus economics makes sense why most families are about 2 kids.

Yes, I think with women it’s not just about “career or children”. Regardless of being a “career woman” or not, more women than historically are choosing not to have kids or choosing not to settle for whoever comes along. So if they don’t meet someone they really like they’re more likely to walk away.

Social pressure around having kids absolutely still exists but it’s definitely lower compared to any other time in history.

It’s the same as how people instantly think divorce rates going up is a bad thing. But again, this is partly due to less social pressure and more people willing to break the previous social codes in which case it’s a good thing that more people are leaving unhappy marriages.

I’m not sure the birth rates will climb significantly again. I think they will just even out steadily because there are people who have the choice to not have children now. And it’s not just giving them the opportunity to manage it financially that will change that. Reducing it to economics still ignores part of the feminist, equality angle of the argument.

Yes some are, I was on lithium too and I’m on Vyvanse - both bottles. But stuff like Panadol, neurofen, cold & flu, all the OTC stuff I can’t think of anything that’s bottled.

I do think blisters are better. I accidentally overdosed on lithium years ago. It was pretty stupid but I used to use a spare lithium bottle for my next days medication. At the time I was on 21 pills a day so when I accidentally grabbed the wrong bottle and swigged my pills, noticed it felt a little more than usual but not enough to bother checking. Until I got really sick and figured out I’d just taken over 30 lithium pills 🤢

Haha was thinking the same thing. Minor issues here for certain medication availabilities at times but nothing that would make this meme relatable to many people!

Yep that’s right, to give to first responders, the person themselves or any other support people that may be involved. Can help people pick up on if anything is changing, longer seizures can mean medication might need looking at, condition deteriorating etc.

Generally the advice is moving everything out of the way, if possible a blanket or something under their head as quickly as possible if they are on a hard surface and calling the ambulance (if someone else is there get them to do that straight away while you move stuff!) Also a good idea to time the seizure if possible! When they come to, have them stay laying down for a few minutes at least before sitting up. Some people can appear to be okay but go back into seizure so slowly, slowly with sitting up and even before offering a water.

If you know someone who has seizures, even irregularly, it’s a good idea to ask them about it beforehand in case it ever happens when you’re with them. People can have different management plans and it also just gives you some guidance and the other person some control should it happen.

(I work in disability!)

Yeah we actually learned very quickly about that in legal studies (high school) way back in 2000s and it was presented like a silly Americans (Australian here) kind of thing, just a quick silly case in a small box in the textbook. Wasn’t til I got older I learned the full story!

We had an Aussie silly case too, not just picking on the US 😅 ours was about some drink in an opaque bottle and someone drank it all before they could see there was some kind of bug or even a snail in the bottle? Something like that so they sued the drink company 🤢 can’t remember enough about that one to find anything on it!

Oof yeah in fairness I’m low income so I get bulk billed! The wait time can definitely vary. The thing I find is that GPs seem to spread their time over various clinics now so if you want to see a regular one (which I do due to chronic conditions) it can be a wait because they’re only in a couple of days a week! That’s frustrating.

I find if I just just want to see anyone for something very routine the wait can be anything from a day to a week. That’s definitely got worse over the years - I remember as a kid being picked up from school sick and I’d be in with my regular GP the same afternoon 😅

Your urgent care is so much!!!? I’m in Vic. I’m not sure how it works there. Here we have after hour urgent care clinics (quite recent, they only started a couple of years ago and popping up more places slowly) and I’ve had to go to those twice and again, free. Which I think is for everyone because it’s essentially a don’t go to the ER, go to these clinics if you’re not actually dying lol. I think I waited about 1-2 hours there. The waits no fun obviously but I do like that those clinics exist now, less intense than the ER can be.

I’ve had to do hospital without private and yeah, it’s not great but I don’t know what it’s like in other countries so hard to compare there. I’ve also seen others in private and the biggest difference is getting your own room (and if you’re getting surgery obviously choice there, I’ve just never had to have serious surgery!) it still seems like a pretty awful experience.

Mental health public though is a disaster - I did it once very briefly as a teenager and then private (as a public patient, I was very “lucky”) as an adult. I’d never do either again but particularly public.

That’s really cool - I recently went to check out one where I used to go but unfortunately the rest of the page is there but no forum anymore.

Yeah I did too, only one or two I keep in touch with now but yep, made real life friends on forums and it was great!

Yes and it allows people such as myself, low income earners, disability, to not have to pay for an ambulance (or an annual membership) if needed. ❤️ I think it’s a pretty decent system especially compared to others.

Australia. A broken arm no fee. General check up - no fee.

Yep. Happened with bluesky. It was pretty decent and wasn’t getting any troll crap that was rampant on Twitter. Then there was some controversy on Twitter and Blue sky quickly went up in its new members and…yep, it just got all trolly and agro 🙄

Personally I just miss when we had individual sites for a topic like when I was a teenager. Grew up on forums for a certain artist and another different site for specific sports teams, books. Way less likely to get idiots if you actually have to actively find the specific website for an artist you hate.

✋ autistic (woman) here and yes, this is the exact kind of thing I would have picked up on if I watched the sopranos. I watch Gilmore girls but not Sopranos. This would have my mind spinning out 😂

Yeah I would assume it’s definitely role-dependent right? Like speciality roles, higher paying roles I understand there’s always going to be a bit of prestige around that stuff but I guess I am more of an average Joe (Jane? Is that a saying, average Jane lol) 😅

See, I reckon we’ve become more degree focused here over the years which I don’t actually think is a good thing. My dad came from England (to Australia) with not even finishing high school and managed to climb up the corporate ladder without ever having to go to university. He was very good at his job, headhunted regularly and retired 5 years ago and still gets offers on contracts because he’s obviously held in high regard.

I think it’s a mistake to automatically require a degree for jobs. Not a dig at you personally, I understand that’s how the system has probably worked there for a long time and as I said it’s come in here too. I just don’t agree with that everyone needs a degree to do certain jobs. Some people do seem to have a natural infinity towards certain things and can excel without the study so I think it’s a flawed model to push everyone to the same requirements.

You Aussie? Haha yeah even as I was typing it I knew it would be a sweeping generalisation because ofc it depends on the field someone is going into and the end goal.

I can’t say I know about how higher corporate positions work these days other than I know we put more emphasis on education now so I take what you’re saying on board. I know my dad started here in the 80s, no education past dropping out in the equivalent of year 10 (in England) and by the 90s was climbing the corporate ladder and ended up quite high (I believe he did a couple of short courses along the way but no diploma or degrees).

He retired a few years ago and yes, definitely spoke about it becoming more focused on what degrees newcomers had. He did also speak to there being the private school boys connections (in his generation too) so yes, all that stuff does exist. Perhaps I have wishful thinking that we’re less focused on that in America.

I’m more lower class than my dad lol, so in my line of work and the people around me - which in fairness tends to be in the caregiving, healthcare industries and much smaller corporations - I’ve not heard people talk about where they went to school or what they’re ENTER/ATAR, etc score was or anything. But yes, vastly different experience than climbing the corporate ladder!

Curious what your experience has been if you’ve seen/heard/experienced how it looks in different industries? Easy to get caught in your own little bubble so I’m always interested in others experiences!